| Jena McGregor |
FEW Harvard Business School professors have had their ideas featured in “Grey’s Anatomy.” And in ad campaigns for Secret deodorant. And “Dilbert” comic strips.
But Amy Cuddy has. Cuddy’s research – her presentation on the subject of “power posing” is the second most-watched TED talk with nearly 30 million views – has leapt into both pop culture and corporate culture, featured in TV shows (including “Brooklyn Nine-Nine”) and on the speaking circuit (gigs, she says, have included those at Zappos, Accenture and SAP).
The idea, described in a 2010 paper, is that spending two minutes before a stressful event, like a job interview, by holding “expansive” power poses – putting your hands on your hips like Wonder Woman, for example – can increase testosterone and lower the stress hormone cortisol. “The mind shapes the body,” she says, “and the body shapes the mind”.
Since the TED talk, Cuddy has heard from people worldwide about how they’ve put the book’s ideas to work in their lives. Among them: A waitress who used it before taking her medical school entrance exam and a man who told her that he sees a difference in his father, who has Alzheimer’s, after he strikes a power pose for a few minutes.
But there has also been some pushback. A study published earlier this year that used a larger sample did not find that power poses affected hormones or behaviour, although it did influence the subjects’ perceptions of their power. Cuddy, back in the headlines with a new book, “Presence,” told The Washington Post that the two studies have different methodologies but that the additional research adds to the field. “When you have a novel, exciting finding, that gets attention,” she said. “People are going to push back, and that’s honestly how science should work”.
Amy Cuddy delivering her talk at the TED conference in 2012. THE WASHINGTON POST
We spoke with Cuddy about her new book, what she thinks of President Barrack Obama standing during his Oval Office address and what affect crouching over our screens could be having on our jobs.
“We’re often hunched over our phones to be more productive at work,” she said. “But it’s possible that doing that is actually undermining our efficiency.” Excerpts from the interview have been edited for space and clarity.
Q: You’re most known for the concept of “power posing,” but your book takes a step back and looks at “presence.” How do you define that?
A: First of all, it’s temporary. It’s not some permanent state that you eventually get to by taking a pilgrimage around the world or some kind of big spiritual journey. It’s something that comes and goes.
It really is the ability to, in challenging moments, know who you are and be able to access your core self, your best qualities, the talents that you need in that moment, the knowledge that you need in that moment. It’s being able to respond to what’s happening, not to what you fear might happen.
Q: The idea of power posing has really taken off in popular culture. It seems to have taken on a life of its own.
A: I think this really illustrates it. About a week ago, I got a facial. I was about to do a TV thing – I don’t normally get facials – and I said to [the aesthetician]: “I want to look good on TV. Can you give me something that will make my skin glow?” And she said, “Look: If you’re going on TV, I have some other advice for you.” And she goes, “This is a little weird, because you look a little like her. But there’s this talk, and if you stand like a gorilla” – she does this pose like a gorilla – “it will make you feel much less anxious before doing something like TV.” And I go, “Yeah, I’m her.” And she says, “I know – aren’t we all?” I loved that.
Q: She still didn’t get it.
A: I said, “Actually, I am the person who gave the talk.” And then she was like, “Oh my god! You are!”
Q: How much do you think the broader conversation about women in leadership has played a role in this concept becoming popular? Are women particular beneficiaries of this idea?
A: I can’t tell anyone we’re no longer dealing with sexism, because we are. I’m not in any way suggesting that the burden should be on women to single-handedly, collectively change it. But the fact is we all bump into people with biases against us, and that’s one of the most challenging situations that we face. So I wanted to start giving people tools that are scientifically grounded.
If you’re going into finance, you might be dealing with a lot of sexism and a lot of alpha behaviour. How are you going to deal with that? How are you going to feel powerful and comfortable with being who you are?
That was a big motivator with me, to be able to lead with that message: Things kind of stink. There are still almost no women on boards of directors. This is going to change slowly. Part of what’s going to happen is we’re going to be less afraid going into situations. And here’s something we can do to be less afraid.
Yet I am still surprised that half the emails I get are from men. I know that my son deals with thoughts of anxiety and fears and pressures as well. I don’t want this to be something that’s just for women. I think it’s a burden that men carry around – to not be able to say, “I feel insecure. I feel like an impostor.”
It’s not until kids are in middle school that you really start to see changes in how boys and girls hold their bodies. Even though the kids are aware of the associations, an 8-year-old girl will still do a cartwheel and throw her arms up in the air.
It’s not until they get to middle school that you start to see that girls start to collapse, sort of roll inward, wrap themselves up. All of a sudden, your energetic daughter is like a shrinking violet. – (The Washington Post)
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